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Acid Runner: Acid gen cap #7850

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TheManWithNoHands
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@TheManWithNoHands TheManWithNoHands commented Dec 18, 2024

About the pull request

  • Adds a 400 acid cap on acid passive generation. This cap stops passive acid generation once it is met.
  • Adds additional acid generation beyond the cap during active combat. This is done by turning on additional passive acid generation for a few seconds every time the player slashes or tail stabs an enemy. If the player is under the cap, this stacks over a normal passive generation. The acid cap itself does not influence if this can be triggered or not, so it can be triggered ABOVE the cap.
  • Adds hud element to show acid generation cap being reached. This is the blue dot.
  • Adds status panel element to show current max acid gen cap
  • Adds status panel element to show if combat acid gen is active or not
  • Changes status panel to show the maximum acid next to the current acid
  • Adds UI element to show if combat acid is active or not.

Explain why it's good for the game

Acid Runner has been controversial for a while now.
The ability " For the hive" is mainly the problem. It surrounds many of the same problems OT has, such as the fact that you can gain something immensely powerful with little to no effort. But outright removing it isn't the best because "For the Hive" is very fun for the player using it.
So let's make it just fairer to get, instead of nerfing the ability itself.

Currently, it's possible to get the highest possible explosion by doing nothing.
The cap on passive generation changes that.
It stops once the threshold is met, and starts again once acid gets lower.

Furthermore, there is now COMBAT ACID GENERATION!!!!
This means you gain 1 acid every tick while you fighting.
This means players have 1:1 the same acid gain while they are in combat, pre-cap.
Furthermore, it stacks ONTOP of the passive acid generation. This means players can reach the cap much faster if they engage in combat. This should heavily reward acid runners to be more active now while keeping the overall acid gain for active players pretty much unchanged.

The cap should be high enough though for more inexperienced players to still get enough acid. So even players that aren't that good, still have the opportunity to use Acid Runners full kit.
If 400 turns out to low, it can easily be changed. Only one value needs to be changed, and the visual indicators for it follow suit. No problems there.

(don't forget to ping me on Discord if you wanna talk balance, NHC)

Thanks to Clairion for giving me the idea of combat acid.
And BIG thanks to Awen who was so kind to guide me through coding problems for hours, and taught me many things during it.

Testing Photographs and Procedure

grafik

grafik

grafik

https://gyazo.com/87ec5a1172540be9f1dbdb132ef16d0c

Screenshots & Videos

Changelog

🆑NHC
add: Added a passive acid generation cap of 400
add: added additional passive acid generation that triggers with each slash
code: added a timer to turn of combat acid generation after a
ui: added status panel info to show if combat acid generation is active or not
ui: added visual overlays to show acid generation cap
ui: added status panel info to show acid gen cap and max acid
imageadd: added overlays for caps, fitting energy, and armor xeno bars. Caps for 10, 20, 30, 40, 50, 60, 70, 80 and 90%
imageadd: added overlays showing runner drooling
/:cl:

@cmss13-ci cmss13-ci bot added Sprites Remove the soul from the game. Feature Feature coder badge Balance You need to be a professional veteran game maintainer to comprehend what is being done here. UI deletes nanoui/html labels Dec 19, 2024
@Red-byte3D
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Red-byte3D commented Dec 19, 2024

#6023 same changes, denied, theres no reason for this other then all the hud changes also damage doesnt need to be decreased at all

you also didnt adress this at all #6023 (comment)

@drawsstuff
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I know this comment has a good chance of being marked off topic, but this entire PR is riddled with typos which makes it a tad bit difficult to read. The typos even extend to the changelog, which I think is the most egregious error you could make.

@TheManWithNoHands
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TheManWithNoHands commented Dec 19, 2024

#6023 same changes, denied, theres no reason for this other then all the hud changes also damage doesnt need to be decreased at all

you also didnt adress this at all #6023 (comment)

  1. I Addressed the comment in your code, wrote it differently, and tested it. It works.
  2. Yes the comment saying that one runner back at hive is one removed Xeno is right. But the change isn't to discourage staying in the hive but to encourage involving yourself in the round. People do it in combat where they wait out the last 10% acid. Passive generation is a tool that encourages players to play more safely, which is not a gameplay style fitting to the size of its reward.
  3. If you want to talk balance, my ping is above. And already am going to tweak the dmg changes.

@TheManWithNoHands TheManWithNoHands changed the title Ligth acid runner rebalance Acid Runner rebalance Dec 19, 2024
@TheManWithNoHands TheManWithNoHands marked this pull request as draft December 19, 2024 05:03
@cmss13-ci cmss13-ci bot added the Code Improvement Make the code longer label Dec 19, 2024
@ihatethisengine
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Good changes, I honestly think passive gain should be removed right away, but this is an okay middle-ground.

Not sure about the dmg, the runner's slash dmg is already very low. And you need brute to break bones and kill people. Yeah you apply acid but who really cares about burns? Half of the playerbase is on oxy 24/7 anyway. You also need to understand that due how armor works you get a lot less dmg at lower tiers than you'd expect.

Another thing I was discussing with people is being able to boom at negative health. Very strong warding makes it really easy to still explode even if people really trying to kill you. The counter point was the amount of firepower and IFF marines have, so I am not entirely sure.

@TheManWithNoHands
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And you need brute to break bones.

Ahhh god damit. That i did not know. Well, gonna get rid of the dmg change then. And i was almost done making it avalibel for all mobs.

@TheManWithNoHands TheManWithNoHands changed the title Acid Runner rebalance Acid Runner, Acid gain rebalance Dec 19, 2024
@TheManWithNoHands TheManWithNoHands marked this pull request as ready for review December 19, 2024 22:08
@TheManWithNoHands TheManWithNoHands changed the title Acid Runner, Acid gain rebalance Acid Runner: Acid gain rebalance Dec 20, 2024
@Comxy
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Comxy commented Dec 22, 2024

Comparatively speaking, regen gain from slashes increased by 2 seems to pale in comparison to the passive regen you gain normally with one each second or so. To keep it balanced to the same rate you should test it and probably increase it to around 22-28.

@TheManWithNoHands
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Comparatively speaking, regen gain from slashes increased by 2 seems to pale in comparison to the passive regen you gain normally with one each second or so. To keep it balanced to the same rate you should test it and probably increase it to around 22-28.

I like you to read the sentence at the very bottom of "Explain why it's good for the game"

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@Drulikar Drulikar left a comment

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I think you have addressed my concerns of communicating to the player when their passive regeneration can't happen anymore.

I'm not sure if the generation from slashes will be enough but will have to be sussed out in testing.

  • However please rework the corrosive acid ability /datum/action/xeno_action/activable/acider_acid. I don't like it drawing acid from a pool that isn't passively generated. If you can't think of any interesting way to balance it, just make it cheaper or something I guess.

@Drulikar Drulikar added Testmerge Candidate we'll test this while you're asleep and the server has 10 players Needs Testing Need to test it on the guinea pigs (production server) labels Dec 28, 2024
@Drulikar Drulikar marked this pull request as draft December 28, 2024 20:25
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